| 2006-04-20 |
| → benlau joined | 00:36 |
|
dmlb2000
| Okay got a problem building gits documentation... seems to work as root but not as a user... I get this from asciidoc: WARNING: non-standard xhtml11 backend FAILED: incomplete configuration files | 00:38 |
|
| if anyone has seen this I'd appreciate the help. | 00:40 |
|
| Oh figured it out, somehow /etc/asciidoc didn't have executable permissions on it... | 00:57 |
| → Chocobo joined | 01:20 |
|
Chocobo
| Howdy all. | 01:21 |
|
| bzr vs. git | 01:25 |
|
philips
| Chocobo: http://better-scm.berlios.de/comparison/comparison.html | 01:28 |
|
| doh, no git comparison | 01:29 |
|
Chocobo
| lol, I was about to say..... " What am I missing ?" | 01:29 |
|
loops
| git is above comparison | 01:30 |
|
| page just lists reasons to move to git ;o) | 01:30 |
|
| strange tho, since it does list mercurial, which isn't as old as git | 01:31 |
|
philips
| there was a doc that made comparisons, but I can't find it | 01:31 |
|
| obviously biased http://bazaar-vcs.org/RcsComparisons | 01:31 |
|
| :-)) | 01:31 |
| → spuk joined | 01:33 |
|
Chocobo
| Mercurial doesn't look too bad either. hmmm, I am just having a hard time learning git. It is the most complicated of all I think. | 01:35 |
|
loops
| Chocobo, what are you having trouble with ? | 01:39 |
|
Chocobo
| well I guess it isn't git... it is the decentralized methodolgy. It doesnt make sense that there is no one place that everything resides. I guess I don't understand how if multiple people are working on a project ... how everything comes together. When something is getting "released" how does that happen? | 01:41 |
|
loops
| well think of the kernel project | 01:41 |
|
| in the end.. there _is_ one centralized repository.. that's the one linus maintains on the kernel.org server | 01:42 |
|
PugMajere
| Chocobo: There is a central repository, but nobody *needs* to have access to it. | 01:42 |
|
loops
| but everyone has a complete copy.. and instead of checking their changes into the central repo, they check them in locally | 01:43 |
|
Chocobo
| so lets say 3 people are helping linus... bob, tim, and sally. does linus need to "git merge bob" "git merge tim" and "git merge sally" ? | 01:43 |
|
loops
| and let linus git-pull the changes into linus' tree | 01:43 |
|
sofar
| does akpm have a -mm gitweb or similar? | 01:43 |
|
| anyone knows? | 01:43 |
|
PugMajere
| Chocobo: yes. | 01:43 |
|
loops
| sofar, he does have a git repo now yes | 01:43 |
|
PugMajere
| or sally and merge tim's changes, etc. | 01:43 |
|
sofar
| loops: url? | 01:44 |
|
Chocobo
| Hmmm, I am starting to think that what I want is really a centralized repo. | 01:44 |
|
loops
| Chocobo, yess.. he git-pulls from everyone | 01:44 |
|
| Chocobo, git can handle that as well, everyone just pushes into the same repo | 01:44 |
|
Chocobo
| I need to join a project that uses it. That is the only way I will learn it really. | 01:45 |
|
loops
| but when you're offline, like on an airplane, you still have all the information handy.. you're never disconnected from the repo | 01:45 |
|
| sofar, hmm.. lemme see if i can find it.. i just saw a reference to it, never used it myself | 01:45 |
|
Chocobo
| loops, so does that mean the local repo contains all past revision information?????? couldnt that get _huge_? | 01:45 |
|
loops
| Chocobo, yes it can, but in practice it isn't too bad.. Plus, git has a way to prune old history from a repository if you don't want it, and still interact with other repos that still contain the old history | 01:46 |
|
Chocobo
| hmmm. I guess I just need to read all the documentation files. | 01:47 |
|
loops
| I guess it can be confusing if you're used to cvs for instance.. because it's a very different model.. where you just checkout one revision from a central repo into your working directory. | 01:48 |
|
| But once you get used to it, there's no going back | 01:49 |
|
Chocobo
| It is the little things that get me ... like the origin file. | 01:50 |
|
loops
| you mean .git/remotes/origin ? | 01:52 |
|
Chocobo
| yes. | 01:53 |
|
loops
| sofar, i can't find it :( | 01:53 |
| → hharrison joined | 01:53 |
|
loops
| Chocobo, well it's just a place to record information about remote repositories. | 01:55 |
|
sofar
| loops: that's exactly my problem | 01:55 |
|
loops
| it doesn't have to be called origin.. and you can have more than one | 01:55 |
|
| sofar, i remember seeing one of his -mm releases a while back that explicitly mentioned a git repo.. but can't seem to find it now | 01:56 |
|
| Chocobo, the reason it has been called origin, is that for many people, they never create their own repository.. they just clone from say Linus | 01:56 |
|
Chocobo
| Is there any place that documents the format of it? | 01:57 |
|
loops
| There may be... it's a bit unfortunate you have to worry about it at all.. there should be some repo-config commands that let you set things from the command line | 01:58 |
|
Chocobo
| yeah, that would be good. I am really not a big of fan of features that hard to find documentation on. I guess that is a big pet peeve of mine. | 01:59 |
|
loops
| Chocobo, one thing about the git repo size is that git has a packed format that is very efficient.. | 02:05 |
|
Chocobo
| I am not saying that git isn't well documented... just that I have a hard time finding it :) | 02:05 |
|
| So how large is the kernel repo? | 02:05 |
|
loops
| one large project offering git has a cvs repo that's 200Mb, a SVN 550mb, SVK repo 550mb, and a git repo that's only 150Mb. | 02:06 |
|
| Chocobo, 126mb | 02:06 |
|
| that large project i mentioned is Wine.. you can checkout http://wiki.winehq.org/HackingTips | 02:07 |
|
Chocobo
| cvs repo that's 200Mb <--- But how big is the intial clone? I would assume for git it is 150 MB, and for cvs it is much much smaller... the size of the most recent commit. | 02:07 |
|
loops
| Chocobo, yes.. with cvs you're only checking out a working copy, rather than all the history. | 02:08 |
|
| however, in practice... you only do an initial clone once... and then from then on you have very minimal transfers.. | 02:09 |
|
Chocobo
| that is true. | 02:09 |
|
loops
| so yes, you do pay a price up front.. but you get a lot for it too... | 02:09 |
|
Chocobo
| So when a user tries to "push" into another branch somewhere.... what sort of user authentication mechanisms exist? | 02:10 |
|
loops
| git doesn't provide any itself.. | 02:10 |
|
| typically, you setup ssh access to allow pushes. | 02:10 |
|
Chocobo
| oh man, that sort of stinks... so you need to do it with users and groups? hrmmm. | 02:11 |
|
loops
| Well it would be possible to build the infrastructure to handle multi-user repos on top of git... but it's not really the way it was designed to be used. | 02:13 |
|
| it's just so flexible, it could handle it if you really wanted it ;o) | 02:13 |
|
| mostly, it's meant for everyone to have their own repos and not need to push to a central repo. | 02:13 |
|
| then someone managing a public "central" repo, like linus, just pulls in the changes from all the published repos he cares about.. | 02:14 |
|
Chocobo
| Well what I really want is a central repo. I guess git will still work fine for that though. | 02:15 |
|
dmlb2000
| Chocobo: I've used both bzr and git, they seem pretty similar for regular use, however git seems faster across the internet just my opinion though ;) | 02:16 |
|
loops
| Yes, there's nothing stopping git from working with that model Chocobo. | 02:16 |
|
| Chocobo, but once you get used to not having to do everything with a central repo, you find it's a much nicer model.. no more locked files.. etc.. | 02:17 |
|
gitster
| I think there is a tutorial for CVS migrants who are used to the central repository model already, so follow that and then send in patches to the documentation to fill what you find missing ;-). | 02:17 |
|
loops
| is that in the docs folder gitster ? | 02:18 |
|
gitster
| Documentation/cvs-migration.txt | 02:18 |
|
dmlb2000
| Anyone want to tell me why the install of the templates is done like this? (cd blt && tar cf - .) | (cd '/home/dmlb2000/share/git-core/templates/' && tar xf -) ??? | 02:19 |
|
loops
| Chocobo, worth reading that then and seeing if it clears anything up | 02:20 |
|
Chocobo
| Well the biggest thing I like about the central repo is the the most recent code is available no matter what computer you are using. See I switch computers computers often... so having the most up-to-date code in one location is a huge benefit. Also, with the central repo it seems like it would be easier to have data safety.... one place to backup everything. With the decentralized model... everyone needs to wory about making their | 02:20 |
|
| own backups. | 02:20 |
|
loops
| dmlb2000, maybe portability.. are there "cp" options for recursive copy that work across all platforms ? | 02:22 |
|
| Chocobo, well Linus likes to say half jokingly that he doesn't need backups because his repo is copied on servers all over the world. | 02:23 |
|
dmlb2000
| loops: yeah... I could see an issue with that, but doing it with subshells and a pipe makes it difficult if impossable to mess with LD_PRELOAD... | 02:23 |
|
Chocobo
| lol. well needless to say mine isn't :) | 02:24 |
|
loops
| Chocobo, you're right that having a central repo makes it easier to switch between machines.. | 02:24 |
|
| But with git, you just designate one of your repos as "central" and always push to it | 02:25 |
|
| so it supports that model, just doesn't demand it | 02:25 |
|
Chocobo
| Yeah, that is basically what I have set up now. (with your help last night) | 02:26 |
|
loops
| was going to ask you if things went okay at work today? | 02:26 |
|
Chocobo
| yeah, perfectly. git seems very fast. | 02:27 |
|
loops
| If nothing else, it is that. | 02:28 |
|
| gitster wonders what LD_PRELOAD issues there are that does not affects cp but does affect UNIXy pipes... | 02:28 |
|
Chocobo
| Oh, the push didn't work though.... do I need to do a push --all? | 02:29 |
|
| Where would you want to push today? | 02:29 |
|
| Usage: /usr/bin/git-push [--all] [--tags] [--force] <repository> [<refspec>...] | 02:29 |
|
loops
| Well, you need to tell push what to push.. --all will work | 02:29 |
|
| once you start using branches more, you'll want to be more selective | 02:29 |
|
dmlb2000
| gitster: mind if I message you with what I have? | 02:30 |
|
| gitster: depends on what you are messing with in LD_PRELOAD ;) | 02:31 |
|
Chocobo
| I have the origin file, so I shouldnt need to specify the repo? | 02:32 |
|
gitster
| "*Where* would you want to push today?" ;-) | 02:33 |
|
| It does not default to "origin", because "origin" makes sense only for people with shared single repository mentality. | 02:33 |
|
Chocobo
| so every time I push I need to specify repo? *grumble* | 02:34 |
|
dmlb2000
| or you script it out so you don't have to | 02:34 |
|
loops
| very easy to add an alias or script to handle that, although i don't understand the reason to not default to origin | 02:36 |
|
| most people would have a single repo they upload to most often | 02:37 |
|
gitster
| We could change "git push" to default to "origin", I think. I do not see any downside now. Originally, we did not make it to default, but that was not done to inconvenience people. It just seemed useless back then. Both Linus and I were pushing into many different places (mostly as backup) so there was no point making any one of them special. | 02:37 |
|
| For example, I push into two kernel.org machines (i386 and x86-64) for my private build, another kernel.org repository for publication, and another local repository for backups. | 02:38 |
|
Chocobo
| Woa, I feel like I am listening to someone high up on the food chain :) | 02:39 |
|
loops
| what would happen if you have more than one Push: line speicified in the origin remote ? | 02:39 |
|
gitster
| I could push into my two repositories at work, but I tend to pull from there -- because I want to keep testing the pull as well. | 02:39 |
|
| I have these in .git/remotes/ko (stands for kernel.org): | 02:39 |
|
| URL: ...kernel.org:/pub/scm/git/git.git/ | 02:40 |
|
Chocobo
| Does Linus ever use IRC? | 02:40 |
|
gitster
| Push: heads/master | 02:40 |
|
| Push: heads/next | 02:40 |
|
| Push: +heads/pu | 02:40 |
|
| Push: heads/maint | 02:40 |
|
| Neither of us are IRC person. | 02:40 |
|
| Chocobo is confused. | 02:40 |
|
Chocobo
| You are on IRC right now. :) | 02:41 |
|
loops
| gitster, of course... | 02:41 |
|
gitster
| What I mean is "don't mind me much -- I am just lurking around to see what problems and interesting issues people are having." | 02:42 |
|
loops
| gitster, it might be nice to be able to call "origin" something else.. | 02:42 |
|
| For instance, Chocobo, might want to call his default dreamhost | 02:43 |
|
Chocobo
| Ahh cool. I need to figure out what those lines mean. | 02:43 |
|
loops
| would need a .gconfig | 02:43 |
|
| .git/config* | 02:43 |
|
gitster
| loops, I'd like to make all those things part of the "per branch config" updates. Seen the "Recent Unresolved Issues" list? | 02:43 |
|
loops
| ahh yes.. okay | 02:44 |
|
Chocobo
| So would that mean that I could do: git push dreamhost | 02:44 |
|
| ? | 02:44 |
|
loops
| yes.. all you need to do is rename your .git/remotes/origin to .git/remotes/dreamhost | 02:44 |
|
| but right now.. "origin" is special.. because it's the default.. for git-pull | 02:45 |
|
| if you renamed it, you'd have to type git pull dreamhost, too | 02:45 |
|
Chocobo
| Ahhhh, excellent! I thought every time I had to : git push ssh://www.frozencoast.org/~/git | 02:46 |
|
gitster
| Symlinks perhaps ? not guaranteed to keep working though ;-) | 02:46 |
|
Chocobo
| I had set up an environment vairable :) | 02:46 |
|
loops
| no. that's exactly what the .git/remotes are meant to handle. | 02:46 |
|
gitster
| loops, BTW, "/who loops" gives me useless information. Mind if I ask if you are somebody I know from the mailing list? | 02:46 |
|
Chocobo
| My name is Eygo Montoya, you killed my father, prepare to die. | 02:47 |
|
loops
| lol | 02:47 |
|
Chocobo
| Ahh good old Princess Bride... what a movie :) | 02:48 |
|
loops
| gitster, I sent you a private email telling you to remove the "git-pull" command. | 02:48 |
|
| lol.. but it was April 1st.. so i tell myself i was only joking. | 02:48 |
|
Chocobo
| Hey gitster... next time you talk you with Linus tell him nice job for me. And nice job to you too for your work on git :) | 02:49 |
|
gitster
| private? The reason I asked was because you seem to really "get" git and wishing we had more like you active on the mailing list ;-). | 02:50 |
|
loops
| yeah.. i'm a fan | 02:50 |
|
PugMajere
| gitster: I might get a bit more active in another few weeks. | 02:52 |
|
gitster
| Wonderful. I've been missing you (and Fredrik) recently. | 02:52 |
|
PugMajere
| I'm currently working on a move to the San Francisco area, taking a new job, so ... that and a master's class kinda sucked up this year, lol. | 02:53 |
|
| gitster realized, by going to the mailbox, who loops is -- no wonder he gets git. | 02:54 |
| → Chocobo joined | 02:56 |
| → juvenis joined | 03:08 |
| → juvenis- joined | 05:41 |
| → hharrison joined | 05:59 |
| → vin` joined | 07:01 |
| → hharrison joined | 08:20 |
| → vrt joined | 08:56 |
| → juvenis- joined | 09:29 |
| → vrt joined | 09:30 |
| → biesi joined | 09:53 |
|
wart
| Anyone alive? :) | 10:17 |
| → boto joined | 11:55 |
| → coywolf joined | 12:07 |
| → spuk- joined | 12:20 |
| → ferdy joined | 12:42 |
| → timlarson_ joined | 12:49 |
|
Tv
| wart: no | 13:45 |
|
| nice 3.5-hour lag | 13:45 |
| → GyrosGeier joined | 13:52 |
| ← coywolf left | 14:11 |
| → benlau joined | 14:47 |
| → vrt joined | 15:52 |
| ← vrt left | 16:02 |
| → GyrosGeier joined | 16:05 |
| → biesi_ joined | 16:15 |
| ← Oejet left | 16:17 |
| → Oejet joined | 16:17 |
| → biesi__ joined | 16:23 |
| → sofar_ joined | 16:30 |
| sofar_ → sofar | 16:31 |
| → ferdy joined | 17:56 |
| → juvenis joined | 18:19 |
| → biesi_ joined | 18:36 |
| → Beber` joined | 19:10 |
| → Eludias joined | 20:10 |
| biesi_ → biesi-away | 20:27 |
|
CIA-14
| Cogito: pasky v0.17 * r94df6c6064c3 /cg-clone: mkdir -p .git/info since git-init-db won't always create it | 20:33 |
| → dwmw2_gone joined | 21:31 |
| → dwmw2_gone joined | 21:34 |
| → Chocobo joined | 21:39 |
| biesi-away → biesi | 21:49 |
| → hharrison joined | 22:10 |
| → robfitz joined | 22:23 |
| ← philips left | 22:25 |
| → schofield joined | 22:36 |
| → juvenis joined | 22:39 |
| → smartcat99s joined | 23:25 |